🔴 A podcast is a parasocial machine

Today’s guest is Eric Silver, a decade-deep podcast professional with sharp opinions on every aspect of the craft and business of podcasting. He produces podcasts, hosts them, and teaches students about them at Stony Brook University in New York. Eric is podcasting.

In this issue:

• 📺️ Two vital differences between audio-only and video podcasts

• 🧠 One advantage audio-only podcasts have over video

• 🎙️ Advice and etiquette for how to be an excellent podcast guest

— Francis Zierer, Editor

P.S. Eric is an excellent podcast guest. Watch our interview or listen to it wherever you get podcasts.

Long live podcasting

Every day, while eating lunch, I put on a podcast. Usually, it’s audio-only; sometimes, it’s video. According to Edison Research, I am one of the 47% of the above-12 US population who, listened to at least one podcast in the last month. The Podcast Index is currently tracking 4,457,757 total shows, though only 352,296 have published episodes in the last 30 days. I hosted two of those. Eric Silver hosted two others and produced a few more.

Eric is the Head of Development at Multitude, a podcast collective, studio, and ad sales provider. His wife, Amanda McLoughlin, is the CEO (interview coming soon).

In 2013, just before the podcast “boom around Serial and StartUp,” Eric decided he wanted to find a way to work in the industry. “No one would teach us,” he says. All the knowledge was “hoarded by public radio or big radio stations,” and the creator economy was a nascent concept. So he taught himself, learning what he could by scouring the internet for advice and messing around before finding work in the industry, including at Anchor (before Spotify’s acquisition) and Sirius XM.

Podcasts as a medium are platform-agnostic; this is beautiful

Eric refuses to stand by and watch podcasting become a by-default video medium. I see two important points in his protest.

I asked him to define what a podcast is:

It’s an audio-first show; this much you know. The second part of Eric’s definition is a rallying cry for podcast creators and consumers not to let dominant tech platforms (namely: Spotify and YouTube) monopolize the medium.

RSS is a technology released in its first iteration by Netscape, the early web browser company, in March 1999. It’s an acronym for Really Simple Syndication, and the technology does exactly that: it enables a file uploaded to one location to be syndicated across many locations at near-zero extra effort or cost to the podcaster.

It’s a democratizing tool for information distribution, making podcasting the opposite of a walled-garden-platform medium.

This is core to Eric’s argument: audio files are easy to distribute and access, while video files are not. RSS is a neutral technology that creators can use as they see fit; YouTube and Spotify are profit-seeking entities whose incentives are not always aligned with a given creator’s.

I should address the fact that The Creator Spotlight Podcast is video-first. And I should tell you why.

The podcast is on YouTube because an expert advised me it was the easiest, most reliable way to find new listeners. The first 10 episodes of the podcast were audio-only, though we recorded video and used clips for social media. We didn’t start really thinking of it as a video podcast until episode 36 — the first recorded with a high-quality camera as opposed to my MacBook’s built-in camera.

We’ve seen an improvement in our YouTube viewership since upgrading my video equipment, which cost us just over $1k. Good video costs money. Our podcast editor’s fee would be around half what it currently is per episode if we weren’t producing video; those slick intro edits don’t make themselves.

But, because we record remotely, we’re still under-invested in video.

One strength of a remotely-recorded show is that we can record with guests without major limits on location or timing.

One problem with a remotely-recorded show is I can’t control my guest’s audio and video equipment or filming set.

If we were to record in-person in a lovely studio, we’d also have to invest in extra equipment and rent. Our guest choices would be limited by who could come into a New York studio. But creative limits can be a good thing, and, done right, the show would perform all the better, and we’d recoup the investment many times. At that point, audio-only would become an inferior way to experience the product; it would truly be a video talk show, not a podcast.

If you’re considering whether your show should focus on audio or video, my advice is to assess your budgetary limitations. Audio shows can be incredibly successful with a near-zero budget; video shows require significant investment to stand out, especially in our increasingly saturated market.

Video is an amazing distribution tactic

This is to say, Eric is not anti-video. Take Attach Your Resumé, his and Amanda’s excellent show where they interview creators “about how their jobs work and how they got there.” (It’s a great show that you will certainly enjoy if you enjoy Creator Spotlight). They don’t release video episodes, but they do record video and cut a few clips to promote the show on Instagram, TikTok, and — yes — YouTube Shorts.

Eric’s take is certainly right regarding our podcast; the choice to make The Creator Spotlight Podcast a video-first show was entirely motivated by distribution. We want more people to enjoy our show! I know some people want to watch. But in the end, I know most people will listen more than watch.

I can think of one more affective difference between audio-only podcasts and video. It’s similar to one of the differences between audiobooks and normal books. Reading a book silently to yourself is an alchemy. Consider a great novel: your imagination whirrs, voices shift from character to character, your senses fire. It’s a wide-open world between your mind and the page.

With audiobooks, you are not reading the book; you’re listening to someone else read it to you. Yes, you’re receiving the same words, but the alchemy is different. There is a third party between you and the book: the reader. Maybe it’s the author, maybe it’s a famous actor. Either way, a third and mediating party affects how you receive what’s written on the page. A good audiobook reader can ignite your imagination, just differently from how you would’ve read the book yourself.

Eric described a podcast, especially an audio-only podcast, as a “parasocial machine.” I’ll take the Cambridge definition of the word: “involving or relating to a connection between a person and someone they do not know personally, for example a famous person or a character in a book.”

The less information a consumer receives (for podcasts: no video, only audio; for books: no audio, only paper), the greater their imagination must work and the more connections and assumptions they make for themselves. You fill in the gaps.

Parasocial relationships are formed through video, too, but creators benefit from the art of leaving something to the imagination.

Connect with Eric on Bluesky.
Listen to Attach Your Resumé.

🎙️ Eric is so good at this that I sometimes felt less like an interviewer and more like I just had a co-host. Here’s what we got into:

• 00:00 Introducing Eric Silver

• 03:14 Crafting your interview style

• 06:04 The details of teaching podcasting

• 11:56 Podcasting does not mean video

• 19:41 The future of audio-only podcasts

• 25:39 The intention behind the creator

• 28:24 What makes a good podcast guest?

• 31:46 The difficulties of guest-based podcasts

• 36:06 Building an ethical creator-first business

• 44:11 The rise of Actual Play podcasts

• 50:08 The future of worker-owned and independent media

• 52:57 Hank Green's best interview

If you prefer a podcast platform other than YouTube, we’re on all of them.

How to be a good podcast guest

An interview podcast is, quite simply, a recording of a conversation. Host and guest owe it to the listener to ensure the conversation is as engaging as possible. This is especially true for audio-only podcasts. It’s all about catching lightning in a bottle.

When a podcaster invites you to be on their show, the burden of preparation is on them. They should tell you everything you need to know: the when and where, what specific prep work you need to do, how to set up best-quality audio and/or video, etc.

But an interview podcast is a collaboration and there is only so much the show’s host or producer can do. If you’ve agreed to go on a podcast, you should do everything in your power to ensure the resulting recording is excellent. Otherwise, why would you do it?

I like how Eric puts it:

Make sure you’re well-rested, high-energy, and distraction-free

This is the most basic thing. You shouldn’t show up to a job interview yawning and hungover; you want to put your best foot forward. Same goes for a podcast appearance.

• Schedule strategically: Work with the host to find a time when you're at your best. I'm most energetic between 10AM and 4PM, so that's the window I offer guests.

• Stay hydrated and alert: Have water and caffeine (if you drink it) readily available. For in-person recordings, hosts should provide refreshments.

• Eliminate distractions: Put your phone on do-not-disturb or in another room. Close Slack, email, and social media apps. Give the conversation your full attention.

• Build in buffer time: When scheduling, include a 10-15 minute buffer after the recording time. This prevents end-of-show rushing and allows for proper technical wrap-up.

Prepare, but not too much

• Listen to an episode: At minimum, listen to one previous episode to understand the show's tone and format.

• Understand the format: Some shows require minimal prep; others require pre-research. Ask the hosts/producers if you need clarification, but you should be able to pick this up by listening to an episode or two.

• Review provided topics: For Creator Spotlight, I send guests a limited list of topics I plan to ask about the night before we record. I want them to have some context, but not too much.

• Balance preparation and spontaneity: Come with any key points you want to bring up in mind, but don’t write too many notes and don’t rehearse. Natural conversations make for better listening. Remember: lightning in a bottle.

Promote the show!

This is the easiest part. Assuming both parties enjoyed recording the episode, it’s rude for a guest not to promote it.

As Eric puts it, “All it does is hurt me because you got the thing you wanted, which is exposure to my audience, and I get nothing.” A podcast guest appearance is an act of content capital exchange; that exchange should be mutual.

• Promote the episode on Instagram, LinkedIn, Bluesky, X, newsletter, or whatever platforms you’re active on.

• Repost the host’s posts if they’ve made any. If not, post the episode yourself.